Joined: Mar 24, 2008 Posts: 254 Location: Mandal, Norway
Posted: Wed May 07, 2008 11:46 am Post subject:
I just read Dpr's post, and I must say, I'm really impressed and inspired. I think I'm going to print it and put it on the wall or something. It's pretty much a complete "dating for dummies" guide ;D
Joined: Apr 28, 2008 Posts: 41 Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 4:45 am Post subject:
Argamemnon wrote:
Sebr3 wrote:
What we do ask is that people who do not suffer from SA or "love-shyness", is to appreciate and understand that some of us guys through no fault of our own struggle to establish normal romantic relationships with women (even though we have tried very hard and have failed). A book has actually been written about "love-shy" men, and there is a website/forum called "love-shy.com" dedicated to us guys who would love to have a girlfriend but cannot due to shocking bad luck/or misfortune.
I have actually never approached a girl, and it has never even crossed my mind to do so. What does this tell you about my confidence or self-esteem? Even though we both have never had a girlfriend, you are at least better off than me in terms of anxiety, self-esteem and probably general well-being. I'm almost 32 by the way.
Hi there Argamemmon, and I am sincerely sorry to hear about your predicament.
Although I have approached many women (and always get rejected), my self esteem is very low. When I have approached women and talked to them I have always tried to be funny,interesting and entertaining. I know I am a good conversationalist, can discuss most topics, and could talk the legs off a chair. But my experience has been, if the woman you are interested in is not immediately physically attracted to you, she will not ENGAGE and will reject you.
Like I have stated previously, if there was a room with 10 women and 10 men, and of those men only 1 of them was handsome, and the other 9 guys were ugly/or average, the 10 women would literally fight and kill each other for the 1 handsome guy (even if he was a wanker), and would instantly reject and ignore the 9 other guys (even if they were decent men).
Anyway, I hope one day you overcome your SA, and meet a decent woman.
Joined: Apr 28, 2008 Posts: 41 Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 5:06 am Post subject:
Carstuar wrote:
I just read Dpr's post, and I must say, I'm really impressed and inspired. I think I'm going to print it and put it on the wall or something. It's pretty much a complete "dating for dummies" guide ;D
I agree Dpr's post was very positive and inspirational, and I commended him for it. But whether you can call it a "dating for dummies"guide is debatable.
You must remember that Dpr has been very lucky with girls (he is most likely a good looking guy in the eyes of women that is), and as such attracting girls would come to easy to him, and good luck to him.
For us love-shy guys, or in my case ugly guys, attracting any woman is extremely difficult, even though many of us have tried very hard and have failed.
Anyway, I am glad you got something positive out of it, and I hope that it helps you.
Hi dpr, and thank you for taking the time to write such an interesting post.
Firstly, I happy to hear that you have been successful at attracting women, and that you are a nice guy as well. However, your situation is much different to us "love-shy" guys who have either never ever had a girlfriend like me (I am 39), or guys who have had very few girlfriends.
By your own admission you have stated that you got off to a good start with women, and as such this would have given you great confidence as you experienced success at attracting women on a regular basis.
Hey Sebr3! Yes, you are right there, I suppose my early "successes" with women helped my confidence for the future, and that is something I guess I overlooked in my original post.
Of course my current condition and addictive personality make it so that I never have enough "love," if you get what I mean. I hope you don't take offense to this, but I think that I probably feel a lot like you do most of the time, constantly seeking the safety of a sexual relationship, etc. So it's not like any of these girls have ever solved any of my emotional problems. But anyway, that's kind of off topic.
While I can appreciate that you have had trouble with women and how so many rejections have affected your confidence (and as you mentioned, i would imagine that would affect anyone's confidence), I have to say that I really disagree with your position that most women are only looking to get with good-looking guys, regardless of other factors (i.e. sense of humour, intelligence, personality).
First of all, I see sexy girls walking around with ugly guys ALL THE TIME, and I'm not just talking about on prime time sitcoms. I seriously can't count the number of times I've seen a couple walk by to which my friends and I will remark "What the hell is she doing with HIM?" They can't all be rich.
I mean let's face it, if there's a superficial, shallow, sex-obsessed gender out there, it's us guys!
Granted, there are some dumbass girls out there who are only looking for muscular guys with spray-on tans who drive fast cars. These girls can be found in many places, to name a few:
clubs
the gym
the gap
But not all women are that vapid IMO. If you ever saw my ex's friend ("A," the one in my story who wanted to hook up with my friend), I think you'd change your mind.
I'm not sure if it was you who mentioned that you'd like to start going to a "dating coach." I'm sorry, as I'm typing this I forget if it was you or someone else in this thread, but I think instead of a dating coach, you should just find and TRY to make friends with girls who aren't into dating. I mean, I don't think I've ever in my entire life gone on "a date." Unless you count dinner with the girlfriend. But you know what I mean? I've never arranged a date, picked her up in my car, gone to the movies, etc. There is a whole subculture of people out there who are just not into that whole stupid dating scene, and I think that is where you want to be, instead of going to some dating coach so he/she can tell you all the things that are wrong with you and what you should change about yourself to accommodate shallow bitches so that they will finally like you. Going out for drinks with some stranger so that they can evaluate/judge you? That's not fun!
Anyway, I seriously think you are wrong about women only caring about looks. There's more to it than that. Sure there is something to be said about power and fame and all that (I mean, do you think any girl in the world would ever look twice at Mick Jagger or Owen Wilson if they weren't already famous?) But without any of those things, there is still something else women can identify with, and I think that is uniqueness. Being genuine, being yourself, being honest and saying what you mean.
Sebr3 wrote:
The story is much for different for ugly/average looking guys like me, who have tried very hard to meet women (I have tried everything ie.face to face approaches, the internet, speed dating, singles functions, placing advertisements in the personals column), and so far I have a 100% failure rate, that's right I have approached hundreds of girls, and have been rejected every single time. What do you think that would do to person's self esteem and self confidence?? It fucking destroys it, as rejection hurts, and anyone who saids rejection doesn't hurt is a liar. I am no quitter, but even the toughest person has their breaking point, and it gets to the stage where you quit trying out of sheer frustration and despair.
I hear you on that man. Rejection sucks. Not to be an asshole, but have you ever tried just being friends with these girls and not "approaching" them from like a "dating" standpoint?
And yeah, rejection blows, it sounds like you've experienced your fair share. But remember, we've all been there. Everybody fails sometimes, or lots of times. Everyone has felt awkward or out of place. Everyone has had a person they really like disappoint or ignore them. It sucks, but you're really not as alone as you may think with that feeling.
You call yourself ugly/average, but according to who? You have to step back from yourself for a sec and realize that there is no real universal law to attraction. Everyone is attractive to different traits in a person, physical traits and personal traits.
I've been called ugly before. In high school I was 5'10 and 120 pounds. All I ever heard for like 4 years was "Look at how skinny he is" (behind my back) and "Why are you so skinny?" (to my face). I wasn't ever anorexic, I just had high metabolism. Even now, while I am an athletic type of guy, I have not much muscle mass to speak of and I still have the "Ichabod Crane" look with the big adam's apple and what not. I used to be so ashamed about this. I even used to try gorging myself on food to gain weight so I would be "attractive" (as if attractiveness is the summit atop this big mountain everyone has to climb up). I eventually realized that there are some people who think I'm ugly and others who think I'm attractive, and that's just the way it is. And I'm not just talking women's tastes either.
A while ago, my friends and I were watching TV and a commercial came on for some restaurant. There were 2 girls and one girl had a bacon taco (or something with bacon in it) in her purse. The other girl asked why she had it in her purse and she replied "Cuz guys love bacon." Then sure enough, a bunch of guys at the bar came up to her and were all over her (because she smelled like bacon). So I said out loud, "I don't get it. Why wouldn't the guys want to hook up with her anyway?" My friends found it strange that I didn't get it and explained it to me. Apparently the girl who the guys ignored was supposed to be "the hot one." She had blonde hair and blue eyes. And the redhead I guess was supposed to be "average" but since she had the bacon in her purse the guys all wanted her. The reason I didn't get the joke was because I thought the redhead was better looking. And that shit happens all the time!
Sorry to ramble on, but there was this other time I was introduced to 3 girls in a row at a wedding. I met one, shook her hand and thought to myself "mmm she's not bad," then met the second one and thought "mmm very nice." When I met the third girl, I literally thought to myself: "ewww, gross." Like those were literally the words going through my mind when I said hi to her for the first time. And well buddy, I swear to you that after spending a few days with this girl, getting to know her and just absorbing who she is, I fell in love with her and forgot about those two other girls I originally wanted to get with, only to have that girl dump me a year later and stop talking to me altogether (something that hurt like hell, and that I'm still trying to get over, and still talk to my therapist about all the time)
But I fell in love with her because she was cool. Not cuz of her looks or her clothes or any of that shit. It happens man, more than you think. It happens to girls and guys.
Sebr3 wrote:
And in any case I more interested in the quality of a woman's character and personality, not her looks.
See! You said it right there. And if there are guys like us, then there are girls like us. It's as simple as that.
Sebr3 wrote:
With regards to acting "too nice", no, I don't drown any woman I may be interested in with excessive compliments, or try to "buy" their love with gifts. Nor have I ever told a woman that I "love her". I just treat women with respect and kindness, and when I do get rejected, which is what happens anyway, I don't get mad, I just quietly walk away. At the end of the day, I just act myself, and I don't pretend to be someone I am not.
That's good that you don't do any of that stuff. Honestly, you sound like a cool respectable guy, unlike that other retard in this thread who is talking about "rakin in the hoes." I really don't know why you are having trouble hooking up with women. I wish I could help. Maybe just stop trying altogether and see what happens? But leave the whole dating scene bullshit behind, if you ask me. Just make friends, with guys and girls. See what happens.
Anyway good luck man. Let us know of any new developments and how things turn out. I just found this forum, but I love it and I think I am going to be on here for a while. It helps me out to talk about things like this.
Sebr3 wrote:
Anyway, thank you for your encouragement, your post was a good read.
I just read Dpr's post, and I must say, I'm really impressed and inspired. I think I'm going to print it and put it on the wall or something. It's pretty much a complete "dating for dummies" guide ;D
Thanks, but I don't think it's really a guide, cuz like I said, everyone is different, so there can't really be an all-encompassing guide that addresses how you should behave around one whole gender, you know what I mean? I'm glad you got something out of it though. I felt I wasn't able to articulate some stuff as well I intended.
One of my problems i think may be that i dont posess instantly "male" qualities that are recognisable, i always see girls walking down the street with the tall, solid looking guys, and yes i know that isnt a representation of everybody ..
i'm skinny and have the punk look, longish hair, i can change a tyre, fix a car, drink beer or whatever you'd expect of male qualities and i have a deep, normal voice, but i dont know i keep over-analyzing why i cant get into a relationship ..
i listen to classical, electronic, metal, punk music, dont mind sad, happy, artsy films, dont drive a hotted up car ...
so i'm not a stereotypical alpha male, maybe that's why?
i think its becasue i dont get out enough
You sound a lot like me man. I am tall, but am still skinny as hell and drive a Mazda Protege (not exactly a lady magnet).
I've heard that a lot of girls like muscular guys because they feel protected. One time I asked a female friend of mine who seems to always go out with skinny guys why she likes skinny guys, and she said that she is attracted to that look in a man because it's not an aggressive or imposing look, like the look of a guy with a muscular build. She does not like aggressive, imposing personalities, so I guess it transfers over to the physical traits she most admires.
I'm 29. During the last 8 or so years, four girls/women whom I've known online have become attracted to me. I guess if one sets the bar really low, one could say that three of them became my "long-distance girlfriends" at least for a while. The problem is that I've never met even one of them in the real life. I just couldn't find the courage / I was almost certain that it would be disastrous.
So if anyone on this forum suddenly comes to have a crush on me, that's OK. Just don't expect that it will result in anything "real".
Joined: Sep 30, 2007 Posts: 31 Location: Rhode Island, United States
Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2008 2:07 am Post subject:
I'm 25, never had a real girlfriend until a month ago, however she decided she didn't wanna see me anymore a week after our 5th date even though there was a good chemistry between us. We even made out a couple times, it was the first time I kissed a girl. I met her on a dating website. We talked online one night, then she asked me to call her. After I worked up the courage I called her. She was pretty talkative, so it definitly helped me out. For our first date I picked her up (which was pretty nerve wracking being in a car alone with her) and we went to a sports bar for a couple drinks. I couldn't believe how much I was able to talk.
It seems like with the whole online dating thing I get quite a few responses, but then when they see my picture they stop e-mailing me. I know I'm not the best looking guy in the world, but I don't think I'm necessarily ugly either, I'm not overweight or anything. I think my two problems are confidence and I don't smile a whole lot. I think that just sends out a negative vibe to everyone that I don't wanna talk to them. I am in general happy when I'm around people, but I just don't like my smile. If I'm at work or something it just takes too much effort to walk around with a smile all day if that makes sense. Also I have a lot of freckles and I guess that isn't necessesarily a sexy feature.
But my point is prior to me meeting my ex-girlfriend I had pretty much accepted I was never gonna get a girlfriend or even kiss a girl. But I met a girl that for whatever reason I wasn't all that shy around. So I think it's just a matter of meeting a girl with the right personality.
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