what is intelligence

one_more_beer · Guest

Is intellegence the ability to be witty and funny or is it the ability to comprehend complex issues. I think there are multi areas of intelligence... yet I am afraid to post at this site because I am afraid that some idiot will misconstrue the entire idea of what I am saying based off of a typo or because they are simple minded. I have a phobia toward simple minded and arrogant people... to me they are the root cause of most things wrong in the world. Does anyone else feel this way?

wistful_dementia · Intermediate User Joined: Sep 28, 2004 Posts: 173

I feel your pain guest, but that is how intimidation works. That is in part what causes us socialphobes to avoid. There are social bullies who will pick on you for being a thinker and there are social bullies who will try to intimidate you because you are ugly, etc. They usually do this because they 1) have a tool or resource that you don't.. i.e good looks or wit and 2) because they have to make up for there own inadequacies by using their 'tool' to attack you.

Think of it this way guest- at least you can use this site as a way to safely desensitize yourself to idiots... you are sort of incognito here. Sooo, I wouldn't sweat it too much- I agree that there are mult-intellegences such as emotional intelligence, logical intelligence, and verbal intelligence, etc... some people are well rounded and possess more areas of intelligence than others, some don't- but there are no excuses for anyone to be intolerant and attack those who don't meet there ideals. Besides the whole survival of the fittest concept will take care of itself- why should we make things anyworse in this short life of ours. And yes, I do believe that we as a human race can bond in order to make each other stronger. Evidence is there to support this concept in other animals who possess higher reasoning such as elephants and chimps- they help there own in times of adversity and sickness. Take care and try not to take this site too seriously.

Guest · Posted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 4:39 am Post subject:

hehe...hehe... you crack me up worry... is that why you are addicted to this site.. because you have won the race Wink

hehehe.... but seriously, why does someone as funny and witty as you have SAD? What are your issues? *speaking very slowly* typos- that's when someone make an inadvertent error when typing... it can really screw the big picture up for those who have difficulty with the big picture to begin with... or for those who may suffer from a form of auticim where they are unable to grasp at abstract or complex subjects... hehehehe... I should just lighten up Smile

....hehe

Yossarian · Posted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 2:51 pm Post subject:

Bloody hell. These are some big questions. To throw my hat in the ring I would have to give quite a broad answer, which may seem like a cop out but its a broad question.

I suppose for me looking at the animal world, it would seem being able to understand the world around you and how to manipulate it would perhaps be a good start to defining intelligence. Which is why less intelligent creatures/people will never be as dangerous as those with higher mental capabilities.

Simple people don't invent weapons of mass destruction or ideoligies which cause genocide or mass persecution and oppression. The intelligent will nearly always find ways to manipulate the simple minded. Intelligence has nothing in my opinion to do with morality, knowledge and intelligence give power which can be used for good or bad.

Where intelligence comes from? Surely the biggest factor is genetic. So to me belittling people who are simple minded is as distasteful as putting down people because of their hair or the size of ones feet. The most conceited people I have met are usually the smarter ones, who think they are better people because they are smarter.

As for worrying about people getting the message of your posts wrong, you shouldn't. Why? You can always post again to explain any misunderstanding. It may not always be the fault of the reader. As you don't like arrogance, which I'm with you on, maybe you might not of explained things properly.

I'm sure no one here is perfect so we are bound to misconstrue one another from time to time. It's not something we can't overcome with continued dialogue (or double negatives Very Happy

). Just because I might disagree with someone doesn't necessarily mean it's an attack on them. Just an exchange of ideas.

LilMissTragic · Expert User Joined: Sep 05, 2004 Posts: 803

We are all intelligent in different ways and on different subjects. I hate those people that use big words and sentences normal people wouldnt use just to belittle you. Its just another form of bullying.
One thing I did find highly amusing though was that I got a certificate from mensa for doing one of thier tests (yes believe it or not, little old me) yet when the certificate came they had actually spelt my name wrong. Even though I had written it clearly.

wistful_dementia · Intermediate User Joined: Sep 28, 2004 Posts: 173

What you said is very interesting and insightful Yoss, but I don't totally agree. Let me respond to your posting (I copied it into word so that my posting wouldn't time out before I had submitted it and then I repasted here;):

One of the dictionary definitions of intelligence is: the ability to learn or understand or to deal with a new or trying situation, so what you say is by definition true. But I think that most people would say that that is somewhat a simplistic definition, based upon the new understandings about how knowledge works. The brain has multiple areas that are capable of learning different types of knowledge. Hence, people use different areas of the brain to cope or deal with different situations. It's only a theory of mine (but I believe there may be some data out there to back it up), most people have average to above average intellegence in multiple areas of the brain which allows them to deal with the world on a daily bases. Some of those areas include the ability to use good reasoning based off of the ability to discern the inner qualities and relationships of different ideas they encounter directly or indirectly on a daily bases---- basically I am trying to say the quality of wisdom or insight . other qualities of intelligence include the ability to communicate easily and be witty, which can't be done without language skills. The list goes on and on, but I am sure you get the picture. Some people are much better in certain areas than others. This extreme can actually, lead to forms of autism and of course containing no or little higher brain functioning is retardation.

Here's something really embarrassing- at one time I was actually wondering if I may have Aspergers syndrome. Some symptoms of this syndrome are finding it very difficult if not impossible to make small talk, but at the same time being a very analytical person. This condition happens to men mostly and alot of people go through there entire lives without knowing that they have it because this syndrome ranges from barely noticable (just finding it a tad bit diffucult to socialize) to very noticable. But of I believe that I am just being a tad bit neurotic about that and now don't consider it a real possibility anymore, because there has been times in the past that I have done well in the small talk area when I have felt relaxed. I just haven't had too much practice at it because... I guess it is in part due to my shyness since birth as well as my parent making sure that I was nice and secluded, smacked around, and subject to hours open hours and hours and hours of rageful screaming... So when I eventually did make it to secondary school there were many hours that I wished I would die because of my inability to both feel comfortable around people in the first place and also in making small talk with all the witty socialites who would try to exclude me or throw me down the social ladder, etc., etc... In my junior high school and highschool years I felt like the loneliest and most freakish person in the world. So what kind of tools did I develope when I was younger? Ironic, because I hate senseless violence- but one was how to fight due to the constant fist fights with my dad as a teenager, and the other was how to make sense of the world around me and what is going on in my life. In other words I would analyze the fuck out of everything. I have made great progress in my SAD in that I can attend school and go out into the public, but due to my SAD I still find it difficult to make small talk which of course is needed inorder to build new friendships. I guess I am telling you this in part as a way to desinsitize myself to the possible ridicule that may come from people who are gifted in other tools. And to put my theories into perspective.

I agree only in part that less intelligent creatures/ people will never be as dangerous as those with higher mental capabilities. Simple people don't invent weapons of mass destruction or ideologies which cause genocide or mass persecution and oppression- not directly anyways! Look at some of the great figures of the world who make society worse and worse such as Stalin, Hitler, Bin Laden, Hussien, and probably even Bush, but the list goes on... these people (with the exception of maybe Bush) had something in common they were raised by very simplistic people who in most cases were very abusive.

Today, I believe that the most important element of intellegence is wisdom. Wisdom is no longer fashionable, because the cool thing now is the cult of personality. Look at Bush and look at Bin Laden, how can any sane person (using that term loosely) say that they are loved because they are bright, wise, or good people. So why are they loved? Because they possess charisma. If everyone was able to educate themselves and become more wise (not necessarily through formal education) these people would be powerless because they would have no support.

So, I submit to you Yoss (sorry, I write this way out of habit, definitely not because I think that I am smart or better than anyone) that eventhough these people who possess forms of intellegence are a threat, I believe that they are a product of abuse and foolishness, which can in fact come from simpleminded people. Because of these reasons, I do believe that intelligence, at least in the forms of wisdom, philosophical and ethical thinking do have something to do with morality. In essence it is not the knowledge which is evil but how people use it which is destructive--- all forms of knowledge probably. And how does the world deal with this? By learning how to think autonomously (independently), wisely, and philosophically. I don't buy into this crap, that we most some how consciously act out the survival of the fittest concept on each other---either bullying people through highbrow language or bullying people through wit- making the bullied person feel like a social outcast. And besides Yoss, I maybe wrong, but I think that you are intelligent and you don't do any of this. Does the possibility of manipulation justify not expecting people to behave wisely?

Ok, so where does intelligence come from- I agree, genetics sets the limits to how smart we become or how stupid we allow ourselves to be. I do believe that it is possible for everyone (except for the obvious- mentally disabled person) to gain knowledge and to excercise their reasoning skills. And, I also agree wholeheartedly that belittling people who are simple minded is as distasteful as putting down people because of their hair or the size of their feet. But, usually (in my experience) the most conceited people I have met are not only the smarter ones, but also the dangerous and foolish people who think they are smart... I myself believe that all forms of intelligence are good- whether it is emotional, logical or whatever... but I do not believe that they equally valuable.. no I believe that wisdom is the most important intelligence. With that being said what make a person valuable? I believe that a person who possesses a good heart whether he is simple or wise is most valuable. Sounds cheesy? I don't care anymore.

Now, me being far from wise or perfect have to justify one of my paranoias- I don't think that I am better than anyone.... as far as me occassionaly using big words or long sentences... I use to write alot of poetry and such- always read the dictionary (there is a great poet at this site- much better than I could ever be!) I like words, eventhough there are many I don't know- there are also many that are good to use simply because they are more efficient to discribe an idea that I am trying to put forward... for example I might use the word subjective instead of saying... characteristic of or belonging to reality as perceived rather than as independent of mind... see, besides some words are very beautiful and bright. I also sometimes forget that I should speak according to the audience that I may be addressing... no offence intended... but I am not perfect, far from it....

TTFN....

Anti-Anti-pasta · Guest

yeah, I think wist is absolutely right. I've never thought about being a mindless, foolish sheep, but take a look at Norm.... he's a wonderful example of someone who doesn't have the ability to comprehend why people should respect other people. It all will come back to bight you in the ass eventually. All of our actions affect the overall way the world is...and will indirectly affect us even on a personal level. This idiot will come to realize why she/he should be more responsible about how she/he treats other people. Maybe she/ he will learn after she/he grows up and experiences life more. Or maybe, this person will mess with the wrong person oneday and then it will be too late to learn anything.

wistful_dementia · Intermediate User Joined: Sep 28, 2004 Posts: 173

yeah, that person isn't insecure, just lacking a bit in the higher reasoning facilities.

richkid · Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2004 9:09 pm Post subject:

Consider: It better to be quite and be thought stupid than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

Its amazing how we create new things to make life simpler, but by doing so make things more complex. Take the computer, wonderful thing you got internet, type documents etc. yet what happens when it breaks down Panic! You have to call the experts or read a manual the size of the computer itself. The key to life is simplicity, not to over extert or be lazy just simple be.

wistful_dementia- offline · Guest

Sometimes just being is just being lazy. The key is not to over exert yourself, but to use our brains and bodies to their fullest extent during our short lives, otherwise we are wasting our lives. No where is that bong? If we don't use wisdom in this life then it is like we are living in a cave. I would recommend reading the parable "The Myth of the Cave".