Make Iontophoresis work!

[skillzx3]

Hey everyone,

I have learned a lot about iontophoresis over the years, but I have not been able to make it work. So I want to ask you, what is the x factor for you. What makes it so your hands crack from dryness.

For me, I have tried saturated amounts of salt and baking soda in tap water (very pure tap water, but I do not have control over that). Saturated amounts of salt and baking soda in mineral water... and that is it. I have not been able to conjure up the slightest bit of effictiveness. The mA was always above 30, so that is not the cause of the lack of effectiveness.

So if anyone has any tips, or expertise on the situation, please let me know. It would mean the world to me, honestly. Thanks.

 

[ultrafrost]

hey, skillzx3
sorry to hear that. one thing I found effective is DON'T change the polarity in each session, change the polarity after 5-7 sessions. another tip is DON't add too much water, just make sure that only your palms touch the water surface.
good luck.

 

[Sprawling]

I found that hard water is the key. Try using either rain water, sea, pond or water from a stream. You can mix half of the above with tap. Save the water when done and reuse. Quantity in the drain seems to have no bearings on the effectiveness... at least for me. In some place tap water just will not work. Adding salt baking soda or whatever else has been suggested has never helped my treatment. Rain water is my magic bullet.

 

[SweatSweatGoAway]

I haven't really got iontophoresis to work, and I use 1 teaspoon of baking soda for each tray. Ironically for me it just had the same effect as Drysol did; it dried up the middle of my hand to the point where it cracked, but completely ignored my fingers. It's very disappointing, and distressing.

I bought some Dehydral cream because of all the positive reviews it has been getting, and it's currently being shipped. I'm not giving up on ionto yet - gonna try out a natural water (sea, lake, etc, as Sprawling said), and see how that goes. Will also use ionto in combination with the Dehydral. I really hope this **** goes away for once and for all. Sick and tired of it, I just want to live my damn life already.

 

[Rexus]

since you ordered dehydral, why dont you order the avert capsules as well and empty them in the water. I hear it makes all the difference. I will try this soon for my hands and see if they dry for more than 2 days. If i just have to do 1 a week treatment, wew that would be awesome.

 

[SweatSweatGoAway]

since you ordered dehydral, why dont you order the avert capsules as well and empty them in the water. I hear it makes all the difference. I will try this soon for my hands and see if they dry for more than 2 days. If i just have to do 1 a week treatment, wew that would be awesome.

Yeah, I'm going to try out some Avert pills sometime soon. If they work, and the side effects are bearable, then I won't need to do iontophoresis. If not, I'll administer it by ionto and see how it is then. Also, I'll keep on with the Dehydral cream.

 

[Sprawling]

I tried 2- 2mg Avert capsules in the water (several years back) for several months of treatment and It didn't seem to make a difference for me. It may work just fine for others.

Ionto can be weird. I've been doing it for years, then when I moved for a couple of months and the new area water wasn't hard enough, I had to basically restart my treatments with the rain water mixture. The weird part is my fingertips would still have some moisture and the rest of the hand would be completely dry. It's like the fingertips have a mind of its own. It's taking a couple of months for the fingertips to catch up with the rest of the hand. In the 5+ years of treatment I know I've had fingertip sweating at various intervals for no apparent reason. My guess it happens mostly in the warmer weather when my body likes to sweat wherever it can.

 

[SweatSweatGoAway]

I tried 2- 2mg Avert capsules in the water (several years back) for several months of treatment and It didn't seem to make a difference for me. It may work just fine for others.

Ionto can be weird. I've been doing it for years, then when I moved for a couple of months and the new area water wasn't hard enough, I had to basically restart my treatments with the rain water mixture. The weird part is my fingertips would still have some moisture and the rest of the hand would be completely dry. It's like the fingertips have a mind of its own. It's taking a couple of months for the fingertips to catch up with the rest of the hand. In the 5+ years of treatment I know I've had fingertip sweating at various intervals for no apparent reason. My guess it happens mostly in the warmer weather when my body likes to sweat wherever it can.

I know! Like the ionto completely ignores the fingertips. Have you tried, for example, keeping just your fingertips into the water after the normal 10 minutes are up? Perhaps with the ionto machine concentrating on the fingertips it will work. I haven't tried this, but I think I might.

 

[cm123]

1. Using rain water is not safe. It is extremely dangerous. You are putting "acid rain" into your body. Ionto transports the molecules into your system.

2. First do the system 1 hour a day in one sitting. Do this for 15-20days. Then do weekly for one hour. Switch polarity every 5 sessions. Make sure the water level is up to about half of the width of your fingers/feet.

3. Use new tap water every time. Add baking soda to make it harder.

4. Optionally add glyco 1mg in each tray.

5. Clean your Ionto Plates.

Which machine are you using? I suspect it is your plates? Have they become corroded? If you are using the Drionic Machine use sand paper on the plates to reveal a new fresh surface on both sides.

 

[Sprawling]

I understand we might be putting acid rain into our body. How does this compare to all the toxins we get from the food we grow, chemicals we inhale and so forth. Drinking milk and eating meat with all those hormones ingested into us probably does hell at the molecular level. I guess it comes down to what we each feel comfortable doing. The molecules are throughout no matter what.

My routine includes switching polarity at 15 minute intervals for a total of one hour session. Adding baking soda, glyco, salt has no effect... for me. I've been using the Fischer Md-1a machine for over 5 years. It does not have aluminum or stainless steel plates, except for a couple of metal washers. I must say I've been very happy and successful with my treatments. It's become MY way of life as has being a vegetarian.

The way I solve the fingertip problem is by doing extra maintenance treatments over a month or two. I have tried treating just the fingertips for several sessions and that also works.

Treatments with rain water, well water, or water directly from a natural spring is probably not any worse than ingesting medication that create side effects through out our body. We all get to choose with or without fear. Our opinions are just that... opinions.

 

[skillzx3]

Thanks for the help guys!
From what I gather, to make iontophoresis more effective, one could:

1. Use sea water! (Will try this out for sure)
2. Add glycopyrrolate to the water (Will try and try this)
3. Add baking soda and salt (Tried this, did not work for me, might work for you though)
4. Adjust the time and polarities

Solid ideas, will try the sea water one out especially and see if I hit the jackpot. I believe iontophoresis can be used by anyone, and cure this darned condition.

What I want to know is: How does iontophoresis work?
There are two trains of thought,
1. Iontophoresis shocks your sweat nerves and blocks their signal, so you do not sweat anymore, until the signal is established again. (I believe that this is not the case, since I have tried instances where I have had insane amounts of electricity coming into me for sustained amount of times)
2. Iontophoresis works by having minerals (or other substances) entering the pore, which create a block for the sweat (very similar to an antiperspirant). (This is what I think occurs)

This being said, I think this is what changes the effectiveness of iontophoresis from person to person. People have different pore sizes (or different pore shapes), which require different things to block the pore (it is like trying to fit a key into a lock, onlly one key works). So what I'm out to do is find something that will work extremely well in making iontophoresis effective. Also I would appreciate your opinions, and anything you observe with your treatments that might be of help.

Thanks for the help guys.

 

[hinder87]

I understand we might be putting acid rain into our body. How does this compare to all the toxins we get from the food we grow, chemicals we inhale and so forth. Drinking milk and eating meat with all those hormones ingested into us probably does hell at the molecular level. I guess it comes down to what we each feel comfortable doing. The molecules are throughout no matter what.

My routine includes switching polarity at 15 minute intervals for a total of one hour session. Adding baking soda, glyco, salt has no effect... for me. I've been using the Fischer Md-1a machine for over 5 years. It does not have aluminum or stainless steel plates, except for a couple of metal washers. I must say I've been very happy and successful with my treatments. It's become MY way of life as has being a vegetarian.

The way I solve the fingertip problem is by doing extra maintenance treatments over a month or two. I have tried treating just the fingertips for several sessions and that also works.

Treatments with rain water, well water, or water directly from a natural spring is probably not any worse than ingesting medication that create side effects through out our body. We all get to choose with or without fear. Our opinions are just that... opinions.

so sprawling, are you saying that the dryness in your hands lasts about a month until you have to do maintennance treatments again? how many times do you have to treat your hands again for them to get back to being dry? also, how bad is you hh on your hands? i also have the fischer md1a and would like some more tips especially the maintennance sessions. thanks!

 

[Sprawling]

My maintenance treatments are every 9-10 days. As long as I stay with this maintenance, I stay between 80-100% dry on my hands. This particular summer (United States, Utah & Nevada) I'm having a little trouble with the fingertips. I've had fingertip sweating problems in the past, and what I'll do is just do an extra treatment or 2 just treating the fingertips.

Without using ionto my hands/feet can get pretty slimy and drippy enough to soak a piece of paper. I get the swollen fingers as if they were water balloons. Hands would sweat when ever they damned please triggering the anxiety cycle.

If I totally went off the 9-10 day maintenance cycle my hands would stay at least 75 - 80% for 2 weeks. I found over the years that this cycle works the best for ME. In warmer months, I'll add an extra treatment 2 or 3 days after a prior treatment. I'll do this every 5 weeks or so give or take.

If I let ionto treatments lapse, I'll need about 6-9 one hour long treatments everyday and within 2 weeks my hands will achieve dryness once again.

 

[hinder87]

My maintenance treatments are every 9-10 days. As long as I stay with this maintenance, I stay between 80-100% dry on my hands. This particular summer (United States, Utah & Nevada) I'm having a little trouble with the fingertips. I've had fingertip sweating problems in the past, and what I'll do is just do an extra treatment or 2 just treating the fingertips.

Without using ionto my hands/feet can get pretty slimy and drippy enough to soak a piece of paper. I get the swollen fingers as if they were water balloons. Hands would sweat when ever they damned please triggering the anxiety cycle.

If I totally went off the 9-10 day maintenance cycle my hands would stay at least 75 - 80% for 2 weeks. I found over the years that this cycle works the best for ME. In warmer months, I'll add an extra treatment 2 or 3 days after a prior treatment. I'll do this every 5 weeks or so give or take.

If I let ionto treatments lapse, I'll need about 6-9 one hour long treatments everyday and within 2 weeks my hands will achieve dryness once again.

sprawling, what mA do you use the machine on. and did you initially treat every day, or everyother day? thanks again!

 

[Sprawling]

I use between 18 and 20mah and initially treated everyday.

 

[skillzx3]

Hey guys!
So I've been trying a sea water mix for iontophoresis, using 36 Volts, 20 minute sessions, and I do not swtich the polarities, instead I let the positive end rest with my right hand the whole time (because, this is the hand I want treated most, and I find it pretty useless to do double the work if I am not even sure it will work). I am on my 5th session now and feel zero difference. None whatsoever... hoping this is just the initial phase that many people claim to still sweat in (although I have my doubts).
Anyways, a couple of questions...
Ultrafrost, or anyone who is knowledgable about this : If I just treat one of my hands, never switching polarity, will only one hand stop sweating, will iontophoresis still work?

And a general question to anyone... I am getting quite curious, HOW DOES IONTOPHORESIS REALLY WORK?
There must be a scientific reason that can be explained, something that can be improved on, something more than just "Most likely because of the current" or "Because the minerals clog your pores"
There must be something more. Like could you reach the same results using distilled water or mineral water (using the exact same amperage, would probably be like 60 Volts going in to the distilled to equal 20 Volts going into the mineral)
Would this produce the desired effect of no sweating.
OR is that no matter how hard you try with distilled water it will not work?

I believe we all deserve answers, I believe that if we put some work into the science of iontophoresis dealing with hyperhidrosis we may be able to cover a lot of ground.

Share your thoughts!

 

[Sprawling]

36 volts?? That seems pretty powerful. Are you using DC or AC current?
I use 18-20 milliamps DC. Some people can use as little as 10-15 milliamps and have success. 36 milliamps would fry my fingers and toes.

Years ago on an older HH board there was discussions about using just the positive polarity. For most of us it didn't work, yet there were others that claimed results. I remember trying it, yet not continuing it. It probably didn't have the desired effect for me.

Increasing to 30 minute treatments might help you? Some people start to become dry after 5 (reversing polarity half way) treatments, others can take up to 20 treatments. There is no sure fire way. Nobody truly knows why Ionto works. It seems to be pure speculation. All we know is that it CAN work for a percentage of people.

Distilled water and/or mineral water had actually no effect and did not work for me at all.
Experiment, have patience, and I hope you achieve success.

 

[skillzx3]

I believe iontophoresis can work for 100% of people, now only if we knew how it worked. This is the most important part, (if we want to increase effectiveness), I am on my way to medical school, and it will be in my priorities to figure out iontophoresis in relation to hh.
Anyways, I use 36 volts, DC (you can't utilize AC), and that produces around 30 mA (the mA that comes through is from a combination of your resistance and the volts coming in).
I will continue treatment and keep updating.

*QUESTION FOR ANYONE AND EVERYONE*
Please post your ideas on how iontophoresis work. Through discussion we may be able to reach conclusions. THANKS!

 

[gg1101]

I can tell you exactly how it works. It basically uses the Galvanic principle of electrolysis to block the sweat producing glands in the treated area.

In a nutshell, when you get electrolysis to remove hair by this method, a positive ground power supply delivers electricity through the body via a follicular probe (needle) that is the same diameter as a hair follicle and it kills the hair cell. See the following picture:

In theory, you could use a similar machine to completely kill the sweat glands. However, there are far too many for this to be practical, and you can't locate them like a hair follicle since there is no hair sticking out of a sweat gland. So, the current from iontophoresis spreads out to treat all the glands at once, and since it is not concentrated, it only temporarily paralyzes the sweat glands. Thus, the need for maintenance treatments.

I believe the level of current needed to completely kill the sweat glands in the same manner that hair follicles are killed would be very high and unsafe/painful.

Now, I will discuss another method completely unrelated to iontophoresis.

Another method of killing hair follicles uses RF frequencies. I'm not sure if some sort of RF frequency could potentially kill or disable sweat glands, but if it did, an active RFID chip (passive would not work) could conceivable be implanted in a persons underarm that would emit a frequency that stopped underarm sweating. In undergrad, I did research in an RFID lab for well renowned business school, where we tried to figure out ways to make RFID more effective and eliminate the bar code system. We also worked with the medical school as well, doing research on Parkinson's disease. A patient had an active RFID chip implanted in their brain, and when turned on and tuned to a specific frequency, the tremors and stability issues that the disease causes all but disappeared. At the time, battery life was a limiting factor, but that was several years ago, and the technology has progressed, but it is still not something that can last forever, so period replacement would be required. As far as the antenna is concerned, we worked on printing antennas onto paper for the chips. I see no reason that an antenna could not be tattooed onto the palm of the hand.

The question is, if the solution was as simple as implanting and RFID chip that required replacement every 5 years, would you do it?

 

[IhateHH]

i copied and pasted my post from another thread:

i agree with baking soda and salt not helping. Less water the BETTER cuz itle make the electric currents flow easier and in a bigger volume so to speak. NEVER change voltage within 3-6 months of first starting ionto cuz it's like starting over again.. i suggest whatever voltage you want to start out with add another 6-12 volts to start.. just to be on the safe side and do 20 min sessions per day and adjust acordingly when your sweating is decreased or stopped.

For doing both hands and feet.. i would suggest do them seperately or just one of them. I only do feet and leave my hands alone.. you'll notice that if you just do your feet.. your hands will sweat more but it's the price to pay for a none sweaty feet. I would think doing both hands and feet will relocate sweating to armpits...

ionto worked great for me using aluminum food trays and 24v currents... but i stopped due to the inconveniece :/

if your thinking of doing a homeade one.. i would suggest getting a plug-in battery charger type with two clips. WHY? because you don't have to worry about charging your 9v battery AND you can always clip extra 9v batteries to the battery charger to increase voltage.

PS: vasiline is god if you have a cut... itle move the currents away from the cut so it won't sting the wound like a b*tch.


-ihatehh