TWISTED LOGIC/ Is mental illness glamorised?

[applesewer]

I’m kind of hoping for a bit of honesty here cause it might seem like a slightly insensitive or spiky subject.
But its like, sometimes when you get these “how mental are you” questionnaires on the net that tell you which disorders you’ve got it almost seems like some people want to be mental! And the more disorders the better!
And I know, for me, all my hero’s had psychological problems (all artists) and it’s like this weird twisted logic where the more psychological pain a person has, the better their art seems to be. Thus, pain and suffering become desirable emotions.

Also, on the topic of twisted logic, sometimes it’s like when you win something you don’t really gain anything – it’s the losers that learn the lessons, so in a way the losers are really the winners. And in that vein, sometimes I like suffering. Sometimes when things are going well, I feel I need to push myself into new scary territory so that I can learn more. But I dunno, does anybody agree or disagree or have an opinion?

 

[Fredscars]

i do agree with you. i also believe that people with a prolbem do want to be 'cured' but also, they are scared of that cure becasue there is a sort of security with the problem, because they know the feeling..to not have it is new and scary terriotory and a whole new thing to try and understand.
just my thoughts

 

[Anonymous]

when i first looked up in my mums family medical encyclopedia all the different mental illnesses...i didnt think it was glamorous...i just wanted to shit myself..i think that..axle,kurt,courtney,jim,janice..they make ...it isnt glamorous..theres nothing glam about being mentally ill..because you cant turn it on and turn it off...i cant just be artistically moody for some arty farty opening gig..im more likely to be hiding in my bed with my teddy wearing pink pjs and drinking wine. the next day ill have to explain my absence. i wish i could turn it off and on. i wish i was fucking woody allen. not fucking him i mean..nevermind. my point...and i do have one..is that...there will always be wannabe psychos and neurotics..but chances are ill never have to meet 'em. heck theyre probably all in group therapy or smmat anyway...

 

[Ewiger_Schlaf]

Sometimes I question myself how anyone could not be a mental of some sort in this world, a thought which might probably lead to glamorisation...

But I would definately prefer being cured than suffering from SA.

 

[Anonymous]

i think everyone interesting has some kind of mental condition. The most boring people i know are the ones who have had perfect normal lives and to be honest i'm glad i'm not like them. There is a label for evryone, but in some cases the condition goes beyond teh normal coping level such as with sa and it is no longer something that you feel makes you a better person, but restricts you and holds you back in life. I agree mental illness is 'glamourised' but thast because the famous people with mental ilnesses are our idols and successful people. They are no different to us.

 

[applesewer]

I think there’s a limit to the amount of pain I’m willing to put myself through for the sake of learning and growing…I think there’s an underlying core need for safety and peace of mind (plus possibly other things I cant think of right now…love maybe), and so with any problem I think they’re the first priority. So if a mental illness is denying you those things then it’s understandable that you’d want to rid yourself of the illness first. But after that, as long as those core needs are protected and under control, other securities I’m willing to sacrifice and other boundaries I’m willing to push back.

they are scared of that cure becasue there is a sort of security with the problem, because they know the feeling

That’s interesting you said that….sometimes your posts really impress me…were you really born in 1989?!!
Cause, yea, I agree. Sometimes people’s metaphorical house’s can get damaged, but instead of clearing the rubble it can be tempting to hold on to it as they feel its part of their identity. This is the problem I’m dealing with at the moment, cause I almost feel like I’ve rebuilt the rubble into a whole new house. I use my pain for my art.

 

[Fredscars]

yeh..1989..15 years old and sick of it.lol
im glad you think im talking sesne. i know people take offence at some of my opinions. its a bit of a generalisation but its the way i think that people are, its like...im sort of scared of going for therapy incase it tunrs me into someone i odnt like. the Fred my friends know is the shy, quiet one...if i become brash and loud..will that really be me. donmt get me wrong, i hate this SA as much as the next person..but im scared of losing me, and i think that would go for a lot of people

 

[Anonymous]

maybe too much suffering is going into this website and not enough into your art. you could be inflicting your suffering upon the straights of the world via your art instead of sharing it here with us. im sure people get used to the way things have always been and theres comfort in that..easier to stay the same than to change. oh but hang on..you guys still have sooo much time to grow out of this little interesting phase youre enjoying. aah hey itll give you both something to talk about at dinner parties when youre thirty something.

 

[Anonymous]

Naw Fred, the SA stops you being the real you. If you're a nice soul by nature, then that won't suddenly be replaced by some obnoxious lout just because you no longer feel anxious around people.

You'll be able to be yourself and express yourself assertively and with confidence around more people than just close friends. That's quite different from becoming some arrogant loudmouth with who gives little or no thought for others feelings. Having had SA will make you more appreciative of other people's needs and feelings.

As for me, I just want rid of this disorder. I don't need a mental illness to grow or learn. I don't want to learn more about pain, I've had enough of it.

 

[Fredscars]

thats a good point guest, and as i said: it was a generalisation..i guess its just another one of my fears, a fear of not being able to control myself..i jsut know from experience the few times i have had a 'spurt' of confidence i have hurt people, because i dont know how to control it as i am not used to it..

 

[avid_merrion]

yeh..1989..15 years old and sick of it.lol
im glad you think im talking sesne. i know people take offence at some of my opinions. its a bit of a generalisation but its the way i think that people are, its like...im sort of scared of going for therapy incase it tunrs me into someone i odnt like. the Fred my friends know is the shy, quiet one...if i become brash and loud..will that really be me. donmt get me wrong, i hate this SA as much as the next person..but im scared of losing me, and i think that would go for a lot of people

I used to have the same concerns as you before i went and sought help but the facts are, are that being shy and quiet are not mental problems they are personality traits all in the genes, its the self consciousness that comes with the shy personality that causes the mental health problems such as paranoia such as " what do people think about me" " they are talking about me and they think im odd" thats all paranoia caused by self consciousness, this then leads to anxiety about ones self and can lead to all sorts of difficulties in social situations and in other mental disorders such as obbsessions, depression, panic disorder, etc. The person that is you will not change because of therapy its the emotions and thought processes that change so there is nothing to fear in therapy.

 

[Fredscars]

thats similar to what my friedn told me, but i am still nervous about seeking treatment...
i think so long as i cud get over my self haterd my sa and other messed up personality traits would soon disapear

 

[avid_merrion]

thats similar to what my friedn told me, but i am still nervous about seeking treatment...
i think so long as i cud get over my self haterd my sa and other messed up personality traits would soon disapear

Being honest seeking treatment was the best thing i done it has shown me that im not a bad person and that im actually a decent guy who has had a hard time or more bad luck than the norm, it has also shown me that im not odd but im actually normal and its just they that i percieve things that cause me to become self conscious and stuff.

You are still young and you will probably find that things will get a little better the older you get so long as you make the effort such as keep friends and try to make something of yourself because you do have what it takes :wink: . I had self hatred issues too and it tore me up really bad. The first step is the hardest but after that it gets easier and you accept who you are because deep down your a great person you just need to accept it.

I would keep the counselling an option

good luck

 

[Crimefish]

Yes. It is glamourised. Because people fear they're boring. They figure if they're "crazy", then at least they're interesting. So loads of people wear t-shirts that say "I need therapy" even though they'd keep far away from you if they found out you go for therapy every two weeks.
The more people pretend to have a mental illness, the more people look at the genuinely mentally-ill like "You sponger/ attention-seeker".

 

[GettingThere]

And I know, for me, all my hero’s had psychological problems (all artists) and it’s like this weird twisted logic where the more psychological pain a person has, the better their art seems to be. Thus, pain and suffering become desirable emotions.

I have noticed this too and in music. Someone in the music business was talking about a rising singer and they said that the artist must have had pain in their life at some time because of the depth of emotion in their singing. Personally I believe it is because the strife in our lives take us away from simple worldy things and focus our attention onto deeper things; life, real love, etc.

 

[Fredscars]

Yes. It is glamourised. Because people fear they're boring. They figure if they're "crazy", then at least they're interesting. So loads of people wear t-shirts that say "I need therapy" even though they'd keep far away from you if they found out you go for therapy every two weeks.
The more people pretend to have a mental illness, the more people look at the genuinely mentally-ill like "You sponger/ attention-seeker".

i get that at school alot.
its like now depressive teenagers are seen to only want attention because there are so many people my age who cut themselves, and say 'god im so depressed' so that their friends take notice. All the popular kids in my class went through a stage of it and would spend P.E. lessons loudly debating how to cover up their arms so the teacher wouldnt see.
People take advantage of it and so the really afflicted kids get bollocked (scuse my french) for it..its a modern version of the boy who called wolf[/b]

 

[Yossarian]

I don't mean to be rude but as you asked for honesty... I definately think mental illness and misery are both glamourised by many. Especially younger people who are yet to experience them both in their most extreme cases in either themselves or other people.

Let me say this that as a teenager I know I did. So I'm not excused from any criticism. First of all there has been plenty of geniuses (I would guess most) who haven't been troubled. They just don't get noticed by people who look for a connection. If you are looking for people with problems why would they? Everyone has problems in their life. So if you admire someone you could find a time in their life and say "Hey X has had a really hard time blah blah" I don't like this trend for diagnosing dead people with illnesses due to rather fourth hand testimonials by people who barely knew them. X was a bit shy so they WERE SP!!. X was a bit grumpy now and again so they WERE manic depressive!! O.K its a bit of a generalisation but hey *shrugs*.

I'm going off point sorry. I just don't like this glamouising misery and linking it to greatness. People say it's more profound or deeper than happiness. Personally I think that's bullshit. Things are mainstream or common for a reason. Not just because people are sheep or brainless. That's just arrogant and pretentious. I don't see many posts on here saying "I wish I were more SP" why? because it's shite. Why do people perform acts of artness? because it makes them happy or fulfills a need/urge thus satisfaction. The same goes for seeking out such works.

Most people who have a mental illness are not geniuses. Most people who do not have a mental illness are not geniuses. Many great people did not have a mental illness. Many great people have had a mentall illness. To me this suggests any link between the two are tenuous (sp??) at best.

Sorry I'm still off topic. I think if you have a mental illness etc you will be more interested in art which deals with the subject and thus its more interesting to YOU. Just like anything else. It doesn't make it better outright. Art is subjective and personal. Personally as I've got older I am beginning to despise the level of grandeur and importance associated with art but thats another subject.

Bah I'm just gibbering now. I guess bad news sells.

 

[Anonymous]

i agree with yossarian. many great people have been screwed up but..many havent been....art can reflect our inner selves...that was sylvia plaths job...it wouldnt be appropriate for george w bush to write poetry for the nation..doesnt mean hes not a nutjob. ah im saying this all wrong. i just agree with yoss basically.

 

[applesewer]

Sorry to talk about myself, but basically my fear is that if I decide to go all the way and 100% rid myself of SA, will I lose too much? I understand that SA is preventing me being the “real” me. I understand that my extroverted side will come out more. I understand that a lot about me will change and I’m prepared for that. But there’s so much about me that SA seems to fit in place perfectly. Making music is the only thing I love to do, what if I lose that? The reason why I love music could well be because I can’t express myself effectively to other people. And what about my tastes and everything I believe in…i.e. that originality and emotion are important to art, and my desire to make an impact in the world. If I change too much, will I accept that I’m just another grain of sand and just fade away into the background? If I rid myself of all pain, will I have any emotion left for my music? Yeah man, this is it. This is my big dilemma…I know some people have got it far worse than me and you can slag me off for wasting your space if you want, but this is where I’m at in my life.

You don’t have to reply, I just wanted to get that off my chest. Some advice would be appreciated, but don’t worry, I’ll figure it out.

 

[Fredscars]

Sorry to talk about myself, but basically my fear is that if I decide to go all the way and 100% rid myself of SA, will I lose too much? I understand that SA is preventing me being the “real” me. I understand that my extroverted side will come out more. I understand that a lot about me will change and I’m prepared for that. But there’s so much about me that SA seems to fit in place perfectly. Making music is the only thing I love to do, what if I lose that? The reason why I love music could well be because I can’t express myself effectively to other people. And what about my tastes and everything I believe in…i.e. that originality and emotion are important to art, and my desire to make an impact in the world. If I change too much, will I accept that I’m just another grain of sand and just fade away into the background? If I rid myself of all pain, will I have any emotion left for my music? Yeah man, this is it. This is my big dilemma…I know some people have got it far worse than me and you can slag me off for wasting your space if you want, but this is where I’m at in my life.

You don’t have to reply, I just wanted to get that off my chest. Some advice would be appreciated, but don’t worry, I’ll figure it out.

i think you talk a great deal of sense, i guess in a way that was what i was attempting to say
xxx