Feeling Unwelcome

Skog

Skog

Well-known member
Hi Water and Blubs

Water, I've got nothing against people brainstorming and trying to find ways to improve. I would like to do that, too. You don't need to criticize a post like mine to do that, though. Start a new thread. If I have an opinion, I'll add something.

I think there's a place for a post like the one that started this thread, too, though. If you want to see it as just me venting, that's OK. I can sympathize a little with Blubs, however. I don't think people around me hate me, but I do think there is a shared problem -- not something to be unilaterally blamed on the avoidant person. Insensitivity by a non-avoidant is that other person's problem and they need to fix that just as much as the avoidant needs to learn to interact more comfortably.

I post some here and some other places and sometimes I think that it's a waste of time -- that I am just reinforcing my avoidant tendencies, rather than working on overcoming them. That's true whether I'm complaining or brainstorming. It's all academic if I'm not applying it. I think there is some value in having this outlet to express myself, I guess. Plus, I get tired of mostly reading material that leaves all the blame on the avoidant and all of the burden to change. As Blubs is experiencing, sometimes other people are rude and insensitive. The fact that an avoidant may have a more severe reaction to that doesn't make the avoidant "wrong" and the rude, insensitive non-avoidant "right." There is some value to Blubs hearing that from someone else and toughening up as she said as she regains her confidence.

Also, Water, sometimes I more in the mood to complain than to work on changing myself. I have tried things (on my own; I'm not under the care of any healthcare provider). I've tried confiding in a couple of people. Sometimes I place myself in a location where I expect I will have to socialize with someone. I occasionally participate in group social activities. I find it frustrating that there isn't more support from people, though, and when I feel like I am experiencing rejecting behavior, it's hard to get motivated to try again. Complaining here (or some other forum) sometimes gets a response that gives me a different perspective on other people's behavior or a new idea to try in the future. So, if you've got an idea, go ahead an throw one out.
 
babycakes

babycakes

New member
LittleMissScareAll i know what ur talking about but i think the reason people dont like us guys is cuz theyre goin thru somethin and they need someone to let it out on u no? they no we are weak that is what i tell myself.
also i think i may no the problem for some of u cuz i wrote it in another forum here it is:

i have all of those things like afraid of getting close to people because i am afraid of them not liking me. i also have ocd which the websites say people with avpd may have. with me, i create these scenarios i my head, like saying really boring things, being mean and being completely dorky even though i know it isnt me. i am those things sometimes, but i exaggerate them a lot, and so it makes me afraid. i think the root of the problem of me being afraid is the ocd because i read that people with ocd have fears such as losing control, etc.. for some reason i also feel ashamed to do things normal people do. i dont like talking pictures cause i feel fake(maybe cuz im not happy), dancing and being able to be affectionate with my family and personable with others. its like i am not human. im a nice person but i feel really uncomfortable being affectionate with my family and friendly cuz i think its not me. i want to be but i dont no. i also think my parents are weird also but anyway i think the ocd may be the root. im also extremely self conscience eating cuz i feel like a pig.
also, i have no idea who i am, but iwant to change it. im 17 and there is good news too. the girls in my school who were mean are nice now. so if u guys are being bothered now at a young age then i say dont worry cuz i think people get oloder and realize u no wat were in this world together blah blah.. lol u no . and itoo fantasize and i cant concentrate. i thought i had add. but i think this is what i should do. first cure the ocd( a combo of compulsions and then my fears) then it will help me get over my apd then over my depression.
 
Water

Water

New member
Thank you, Skog, for a very intelligent and fair reply. I admit, venting can very much be healthy.. especially if you go back later and analyze your venting. When you're analyzing your own head, you might not be able to see how distorted your thinking was when you were merely venting.

I suppose I could have framed my response in a less confrontational and aggressive manner as well. I certainly coulda made it sound less abusive and more constructive, I admit.

Now as for the problem being with more than just the avoidant, I have a tendency to disagree here. The world wont change for us. We can't go on an education campaign asking for sensitivity. I think avoidant people tend to expect everyone to be reasonably kind. The world's not like this. The avoidant person needs to accept that no matter who they are or what they do there will always be haters and that's ok. It's ok because that's just an unfortunate fact about humanity. Even imensely popular people have hateful people saying really awful things about them. Imagine if Britney Spears let the haters get to her ego? She'd be curled up in a fetal position right now!

The world is cruel, and thy do like to pick on the weak an sensitive! I admit that. But ideally the avoidant will learn to cope with this and have enough self-esteem to shrug off the haters, or even laugh at themselves. It's amazing how disarming laughing at yourself can be. It shows people you're confident enough to do so and often, if done right, makes the hater just look like a jerk.

Yes, if the world was a wonderful rational friendly place, the sensitive people would probably well adapted and not avoident (I've experienced this a bit myself traveling to places where people generally are nice and if not they fake it until they vent behind closed doors about who the hate) it's incredibly liberating to be in a situation such as this... but alas our culture is not so easy. We're blunt, rude, plain mean.

I would also say that how you feel when someone hates on you is important. Use it to guage yourself esteem. If you feel their right and you feel shamed, guilty, or like a loser - your self esteem needs more work. If you realize that cuerlty and unfairness is THEIR problem not yours - or even react with some anger, chances are your self esteem is in better shape.

But as for ideas and things to try to improve - and starting a new thread about that, it's a great idea. Your suggestions are good too, and I might explore those and brainstorm others and start a thread.
 
Skog

Skog

Well-known member
Water said:
Now as for the problem being with more than just the avoidant, I have a tendency to disagree here.
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Now there's a new post you can start for discussion. Are avoidants' "avoidant'" problems fairly laid solely upon themselves, or is there some fault to be shared by those around them?
 
Tryin

Tryin

Well-known member
hell yes, EVERYONE does make me feel unwelcome. or maybe it is just that I DO feel unwelcome. i (and you too) should rather stop this because the more you feel (and behave) unwelcome, the more uncomfortable will people feel around you. the problem is in my mind. i know that - and still feel so much unwanted. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

oh my gosh i feel so down today :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: please someone write me a private message will you? shit this is hell :cry: :cry: i don"t wanna feel like this :cry: want to be happy :cry: what the hell"s up with me? :cry: :cry:
 
Skog

Skog

Well-known member
Tryin said:
hell yes, EVERYONE does make me feel unwelcome. or maybe it is just that I DO feel unwelcome. . . .
Click to expand...



Oh Tryin, this is kind of a negative thread and now I feel like I need to say something positive. I don't want you or anyone else feeling bad.

How about you try an experiment? Pick one person you have regular contact with at school, work, whereever it is you spend a lot of time away from home. You are going to stop feeling unwelcome with respect to that one person. You are going to kill that person with kindness (does that expression translate). No matter what your mind tries to tell you about how that person would prefer you just leave him or her alone, you are going to recognize that your mind may be mistaken, and who could object to someone just being nice to them all the time. Say "good morning" when you see that person in the morning; hold the door when he or she is entering or leaving; compliment the person on a new article of clothing, haircut, apparent weight loss, job well done (or something). Stop yourself and resist any urge to be sarcastic or critical or rude to that person. You are going to go out of your way to be nice to that person, think nice thoughts about that person, and whenever you have the opportunity say nice things to others about that one person.

Unfortunately, this is kind of a long term experiment -- please give it at least 6 weeks. See if you don't start to feel more welcome around that person. I bet you do. If it works, decide what you want to do next with the experiment. You can try to get to know the person better and see if a friendship develops. You can add another person to the experiment and keep doing that until you feel welcome with lots of people. You can alter the experiment in whatever way your imagination directs. If the experiment doesn't work, I'm sorry, but it won't hurt you to have someone think of you as nice.
 
thequietone

thequietone

Well-known member
Um....I don't know what all this medication advertisment has to do with the thread but...I just wanted to add,
that if we had enough self esteem inside, the judgement of others wouldn't affect us so much. People who (intentionally or not, real or imagined) make us feel unwelcome are reinforcing what we believe to be true. That we don't belong. That's why it hurts so bad. That's why it isn't easy to throw this disease away and say, "I don't care what anyone thinks."

We can't change others, but with a lot of hard work I think and hope it is possible to accept yourself. And when you do that, you gain confidence. When people see that you accept yourself, they can't hurt you anymore.
 
Anonymous

Anonymous

Well-known member
Hi,
I found quite a bit of this thread interesting and revealing. I actually agree with both the person (sorry, forgot your names now) who said that the problem isn't all the avoidant's fault, as well as that it is all the avoidant's fault.

...yep, that's right, I've contradicted my self on purpose. What I simply mean by this is that other people definetly worry about fitting in and are sensitive to what others think of them. We with anxiety are most likely some of the most sensitive; and pretty much the case is that the more a person shares our problem the more they pick-on us. -Notice the poster who wrote that upon meeting someone else who also had anxiety that they found them really difficult and hated them-? ....so: yes, other's definetly share our problem and we do undfortunately make others feel more like us and some people deal with this by hating us and pushing us away.

And so to the person who was venting: trust your feelings: you are right: you are not so odd or unusual in your sensitivity and dependency towards others liking and accepting you. ...and if it is that you are a little more sensitive than most and that you have gotten into a rut as a result of always having the same thinking: everything is always heaps worse and hard when you are in a rut: it's all blown out of perspective. So that a little difference between you and others makes such difference. ...You see you are right. RIGHT RIGHT RIGHT. I encourage you as much as possible.


...Now: what to do about it? ....can you ever get other's to change? ...moreover, now that we have more confidence that we are not alone in being needy of others approval (see above) and we therefore are more confident of ourselves -your need to establish that others are 'closet social phobics' to their own varying degrees (and that the most judgemental of these are most like you) is a very important step I believe. Now, the next step would be to ask yourself: what should I do? Now I know I'm not the only one with insecurities and self-doubts and strong needs for approval (etc....etc) -how should I deal with all these 'closet social phobes'? ...If nasty, judgemental people are also scared and yet they deal with it by taking it out on others, then you can figure out the rest.

So, yes we are not really so different at all from others; and those who judge us the most harshly are the most similar to us (yet, that doesn't mean that we would necessarily choose to be awful to someone with our problem, we may feel the impulse but have more respect anyway) And also the onus is all upon us to change simply because it can't happen any other way. So I think that both people above are right.
 
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